Zettelkasten Forum


The Complete Guide to Atomic Note-Taking

Atomicity refers to the idea that knowledge is made up of discrete building blocks. The Principle of Atomicity is a processing direction in note-taking, aiming for one knowledge building block per note. It is not a rigid law, but a guiding compass. It needs to be contextualised for each application.

https://zettelkasten.de/atomicity/guide/

Post edited by ctietze on

Author at Zettelkasten.de • https://christiantietze.de/

Comments

  • edited October 2025

    Some thoughts:

    • The opening image is nonsense to me. After reading the article, I still don't get how it ties to atomicity besides having an old school depiction of an atom in it. I feel like this was generated with AI.... Nonetheless I still like it and was pulled in/pleasantly surprised by it (was going to read the article anyway).
    • I have a love-hate relationship with the fisherman/scuba diver image. I don't like how there is no visual distinction between the fisherman and scuba diver (probably because AI image generation isn't sophisticated enough?). But I do like the analogy a lot.
    • My approach to the concept of "atomicity in notes" is always to base it in utility. I start with a certain level of atomicity (pulling all the relevant information out of a book and putting it in a single Zotero note) and then slowly make more atomic notes out of the material as it is useful.

    I feel you are missing a third option where they are not saying you have to rely on heuristics and are willing to engage (not stating this is the case here, just an observation). They hear you out and just believe you are over-complicating a concept because you don't have a strong grasp of what is important in relation to the concept and are adding details /or sub-concepts that are unimportant.

    "Level 3 is where a lot of people put up resistance: they either claim that this is entirely unnecessary (heuristics are good enough) or complain that I make concepts more complicated than they should be."


    I am not following what the problem of level 3 is in the context of this article. I looked back and was not able to work out what it is. I also don't think I have a strong grasp of what are the details that make up level 3 overall. Could have used 1-2 sentences stating what the procedures of the method are that differentiate from keeping a zettelkasten without the zettelkasten method.

    The solution to the problem of level 3 lies in level 4.


    I love level 4 and think about it a lot. I secretly wish I had my own coding skills (don't have the will to try vibe coding) to experiment with creating Obsidian plugins that can help with pushing one towards better thinking.

    Level 4 is reached when you see that level 3 is actually about sound thinking and not some methodological gimmick. If you want to become a deep and skillful thinker, you should not only reach level 4 but truly embrace it. Unleash the full power of your thinking tools on the thinking challenge at hand.


    I really like Super Memo Guru (Piotr Wozniak) definitions for Concept and Model. I think of a model as a set of concepts connected by rules. I also don't quite agree with your knowledge building blocks, as they don't seem discrete enough from each other. As to me models are made up of concepts. Hypotheses are made up of arguments. I have no clue what I would say the building blocks of knowledge are instead.

    Concepts define a specific part of the world. You draw a boundary and say, “This is X.” Models relate entities to each other and provide part-to-part relationships and part-to-whole relationships, often to map a part of reality or a fictional reality.


    I was completely lost on this aspect. I understand the zettelkasten iceberg level 2 and 3 but am not following along with what actually is atomicity level 2 and 3.

    Equipped with this inventory, it is simple, yet often hard to move from atomicity level 2 to level 3: You identify the knowledge building block and make sure that you neither miss any part, nor put anything unrelated in the note.


    This is big to me and something I wonder a lot about. It makes me think this Andy Matuschak Patreon article. It unfortunately is locked behind a Patreon wall and I didn't make a copy of it, so I don't have exact quotes of what I'm thinking about. But he discusses how he abandoned his evergreen notes practice as it was accumulating too much technical debt, much better to just create a flat outline of sorts (Cal Newport style) per project. I thought that would be an interesting topic to tackle on the blog and see how you've handled that concern of technical debt over the years in your zettelkasten.

    Your future self wants everything to be available with a single glance. It doesn’t want to be burdened by a lot of clicking and link-following.


    • The rope image/analogy. I thought the idea was to take the rope out of the photo (De-Contextualize it) so you aren’t distracted by the contextualization (e.g oh is that tall tower, I wonder if that is Seattle, starts googling seattle skyline). And then you can use the the image of the rope in other images.
    • Don't quite agree with the maturation stage names. Seems like idea stage is same thing as thinking stage. I would conceptualize it more along the lines of 1. Inkling Stage, 2. Initial Stage, 3. Refinement Stage, 4. Implement/Action Stage

    Impulse of creating/notes without directly moving to a later stage of maturity seems dangerous to me. Getting into Collector's Fallacy territory. This reminds me of how the brain generates an overabundance of neurons and synapses then prunes them to become more efficient. I think the worry is if you spend to much time in impulses than you never get around to pruning and aren’t particularly efficient. I’d say a certain level of efficiency is necessary due to our limited time/energy on this planet. Why do I say all this? Because impulsing without pruning or maturation feels good (collectors fallacy).

    If you have the impulse to record an idea, create a note. This will turn your Zettelkasten into a home for your mind and thinking. To make this happen, you have to accept that your Zettelkasten will reflect the various stages of the maturity of your thinking.

    Post edited by Nick on
  • I got confused because you put your comment before the quote. I am pretty sure that it is the convention to put the quote first and then your comment. The dividers didn't show in the post, which would've helped.

    @Nick said:
    Some thoughts:

    • The opening image is nonsense to me. After reading the article, I still don't get how it ties to atomicity besides having an old school depiction of an atom in it. I feel like this was generated with AI.... Nonetheless I still like it and was pulled in/pleasantly surprised by it (was going to read the article anyway).

    It is based on a specific pattern-language of meaning. The eye is the all-seeing eye that emerges as a phenomonon in schizophrenia as a result of an overactive left hemisphere and a dysfunctional right hemisphere. A feeling of being constantly watched. (Based on Iain McGilchrist)

    The puppy is the self, still unformed and full of potential. It can be both the user and the idea aiming up.

    It is AI-generated.

    "Level 3 is where a lot of people put up resistance: they either claim that this is entirely unnecessary (heuristics are good enough) or complain that I make concepts more complicated than they should be."

    I feel you are missing a third option where they are not saying you have to rely on heuristics and are willing to engage (not stating this is the case here, just an observation). They hear you out and just believe you are over-complicating a concept because you don't have a strong grasp of what is important in relation to the concept and are adding details /or sub-concepts that are unimportant.

    This is based on my observation. So, I miss the third option, since I wished people would engage with the level 3 concepts.

    The solution to the problem of level 3 lies in level 4.

    I am not following what the problem of level 3 is in the context of this article. I looked back and was not able to work out what it is. I also don't think I have a strong grasp of what are the details that make up level 3 overall. Could have used 1-2 sentences stating what the procedures of the method are that differentiate from keeping a zettelkasten without the zettelkasten method.

    Level 3 lacks the justification. The problem of level 3 is that it solves level 2 problems by giving a formal framework on how to make sure that you understand what an atom is (scuba diver directly looking). With this framework, you can actually make sense of heuristics more and use them more effectively. But level 3 still lacks a deeper justification of why this actually should work. Level 4 provides the justification by stating that atomicity is a trait of knowledge itself and the principle of atomicity is a principle of treating knowledge accordingly.

    "Level 4 is reached when you see that level 3 is actually about sound thinking and not some methodological gimmick."

    Level 4 is reached when you see that level 3 is actually about sound thinking and not some methodological gimmick. If you want to become a deep and skillful thinker, you should not only reach level 4 but truly embrace it. Unleash the full power of your thinking tools on the thinking challenge at hand.

    I love level 4 and think about it a lot. I secretly wish I had my own coding skills (don't have the will to try vibe coding) to experiment with creating Obsidian plugins that can help with pushing one towards better thinking.

    I think it is a good idea to learn to code for one's thinking ability. I am not sure how to learn to code to gain general benefits. I think it is the same with strength training for athletics. If you are really weak, any strength training will benefit you. But none of the people who are reading this are the equivalent of weak. So, a more sophisticated approach is needed.

    Concepts define a specific part of the world. You draw a boundary and say, “This is X.” Models relate entities to each other and provide part-to-part relationships and part-to-whole relationships, often to map a part of reality or a fictional reality.

    I really like Super Memo Guru (Piotr Wozniak) definitions for Concept and Model. I think of a model as a set of concepts connected by rules. I also don't quite agree with your knowledge building blocks, as they don't seem discrete enough from each other. As to me models are made up of concepts. Hypotheses are made up of arguments. I have no clue what I would say the building blocks of knowledge are instead.

    You are mixing two frameworks here. If you go with the definitions of Wozniak, you can't make any consistency claim about the inventory, since the consistency is dependent on the condition that you go with the definitions. It is like exchanging sugar for honey, wheat flour with rice flour and then claim that the recipe is not working.

    But I won't defend my inventory here. You can use any inventory of building blocks that you like. Well, the inventory should be working. Meaning: It should not just be a bunch of definitions but a bundle of ideas, methods, thinking tools etc.

    To create an inventory, you need to have a reasonable framework of completeness of what you are mapping. If we are talking about knowledge building block, the inventory should map the process of knowledge work.

    Equipped with this inventory, it is simple, yet often hard to move from atomicity level 2 to level 3: You identify the knowledge building block and make sure that you neither miss any part, nor put anything unrelated in the note.

    I was completely lost on this aspect. I understand the zettelkasten iceberg level 2 and 3 but am not following along with what actually is atomicity level 2 and 3.

    Atomicity level 2 means that you applied heuristics, level 3 means that you identified the knowledge building block and made sure that the note just contains this one building block.

    Your future self wants everything to be available with a single glance. It doesn’t want to be burdened by a lot of clicking and link-following.

    This is big to me and something I wonder a lot about. It makes me think this Andy Matuschak Patreon article. It unfortunately is locked behind a Patreon wall and I didn't make a copy of it, so I don't have exact quotes of what I'm thinking about. But he discusses how he abandoned his evergreen notes practice as it was accumulating too much technical debt, much better to just create a flat outline of sorts (Cal Newport style) per project. I thought that would be an interesting topic to tackle on the blog and see how you've handled that concern of technical debt over the years in your zettelkasten.

    I had a short exchange with Andy over this very topic. There were quite some issues with his practice, which explain the problems he had, at least in part.

    It is indeed an interesting topic which I wouldn't label as technical debt but the problem maintenance. But there is no conscious solution on my part. The reason why I have almost zero technical debt is that my Zettelkasten practice is pretty much just a thinking practice. So, I don't have to clean anything up, just to keep everything tidy and working on the level of the method. If something is messy, it is messy for a good reason: My level of thinking is still messed up. I don't engage with messy areas of my Zettelkasten, unless I want to progress my understanding. If I need to connect a new idea to something that is messy in my Zettelkasten, I will clean that mess up as an act of furthering my understanding.

    One aspect, for example, why Andy accumulates technical debt is that his Evergreen Note are public. This creates the need for them to be understood by others. There is a lot of stuff in my Zettelkasten that nobody than me can understand, that violates good practices etc. But it is my personal Zettelkasten and I don't need to care. When I see that something is inconsistent, incoherent or whatever, I can just accept it or write a comment with a quick idea on how to fix this and then move on. Impossible if the notes are available to others.

    But I don't want to dissect Andy's notes in a thread in a forum because Andy's work warrants a more careful approach than a spontaneously generated answer.

    • The rope image/analogy. I thought the idea was to take the rope out of the photo (De-Contextualize it) so you aren’t distracted by the contextualization (e.g oh is that tall tower, I wonder if that is Seattle, starts googling seattle skyline). And then you can use the the image of the rope in other images.
    • Don't quite agree with the maturation stage names. Seems like idea stage is same thing as thinking stage. I would conceptualize it more along the lines of 1. Inkling Stage, 2. Initial Stage, 3. Refinement Stage, 4. Implement/Action Stage

    Your stages seem to be on the level of workflow. I oriented myself by the maturation stages in practical knowledge work.

    If you have the impulse to record an idea, create a note. This will turn your Zettelkasten into a home for your mind and thinking. To make this happen, you have to accept that your Zettelkasten will reflect the various stages of the maturity of your thinking.

    Impulse of creating/notes without directly moving to a later stage of maturity seems dangerous to me. Getting into Collector's Fallacy territory. This reminds me of how the brain generates an overabundance of neurons and synapses then prunes them to become more efficient. I think the worry is if you spend to much time in impulses than you never get around to pruning and aren’t particularly efficient. I’d say a certain level of efficiency is necessary due to our limited time/energy on this planet. Why do I say all this? Because impulsing without pruning or maturation feels good (collectors fallacy).

    It is a straightforward condition: If you want to make the Zettelkasten a home for your mind and thinking, you should move the complete thinking process into the Zettelkasten.

    You are right that there is a problem of the Collector's Fallacy. However, the root cause of the problem is not to be found in the method, but in one's approach to knowledge. A person that never disciplined his mind to follow through after the first impulse, will not do it with any system and external pressure (e.g. a deadline for an essay) will be the mechanism of making this happen.

    If you try to deligate the mind's disciplination to external constraints, you risk of detraining your mind or never developing its discipline in the first place.

    But you can watch the video to see that it works if you practice it. :)

    I am a Zettler

  • edited October 2025

    I encourage whoever is reading this to check out S.S. Seward’s Note-taking (available free on Google Books). He anticipates the concept of atomicity when he instructs the reader to capture the idea of a curious portion of a text or lecture. That’s all the principle of atomicity is about. Capturing ideas. Not a summary, or an enumeration of facts and the secondary details pertinent to an idea but the special discrete points that the author is trying to communicate throughout the text.

    Knowledge building blocks give you a mental bank of the type of ideas you that you find in a text. The stages of an atomic note are just ways to track the development of an idea—from a speculative bit of information into a concrete intimation that affects how you think and behave after its registered in your mind as correct.

    @Nick said:
    Impulse of creating/notes without directly moving to a later stage of maturity seems dangerous to me. Getting into Collector's Fallacy territory. This reminds me of how the brain generates an overabundance of neurons and synapses then prunes them to become more efficient. I think the worry is if you spend to much time in impulses than you never get around to pruning and aren’t particularly efficient. I’d say a certain level of efficiency is necessary due to our limited time/energy on this planet. Why do I say all this? Because impulsing without pruning or maturation feels good (collectors fallacy).

    Only taking notes on things that you intend to advance according to an implicit timeline sounds dangerous too. Like Sascha, I think this disrupts an inherently internal phenomenon by introducing external stakes. This is something that inhibited my own processes in the past. I reckon as of late that efficient impulses are a matter of taste—being able to distinguish what bits of information are relevant to your broader research and anticipating their usefulness. This is where having a “toolbox of building blocks” comes in handy. Luc B. Beaudoin’s CUP’A method is a terrific heuristic for processing information. I use Notenik to store my knowledge base and it gives you different ways to view your collection of note files in the UI. With the Status field I can store the stages of my notes as numerical values and sort them. This is just an example of ways you can track the progress of notes made on an impulse. Although I must confess, I can’t think of any note of my own that wasn’t conceived like this.

    @Sascha said:
    Your stages seem to be on the level of workflow. I oriented myself by the maturation stages in practical knowledge work.

    I think this is one of the strongest distinctions to make when talking about knowledge work. Productivity is one thing with its own set of practices and interests. “Practical knowledge work” (researching, note-taking, composing, publishing) is another. Atomic note-taking is an epistemic framework or a toolkit for working with knowledge. Something than your workflow can adapt to. I find that Nick’s reservations with impulsive notes are addressed here and in the broader section from where this passage originates:

    There is no rule about the timeline when a note has to mature. You can start recording your thinking in your 20s, continue through your 30s, complete your first draft in your 40s, refine it through your 50s, and finally bring the idea to fruition in your 60s. Is this too outlandish for your taste? What about starting to write in the evening, being interrupted, and finishing the note the next morning? This is a perfectly normal development: otherwise, we’d have to assume that while we slept, our Zettelkasten was in an impure state, that leaving it in the evening breached protocol, and that it returned to purity only the next morning when we finished the note. I think that’s ridiculous.

    The Zettelkasten Method as a whole seems impartial to any one productivity method. Bring your own. Sascha’s integration of BASB into his own system gave me some insight into this.

    What we’re looking to achieve with our notes is made straightforward in this piece:

    1. Facilitate thinking
    2. [Take] a snapshot of your thinking, and observe it
    3. Capture individual ideas as building blocks for future efforts

    When it comes to cultivating knowledge I don’t think empirical data is always an appropriate metric for efficiency.

    Resources like “SuperMemo Guru” appear inclined toward productivity. Beaudoin has a term that I’m fond of, “Cognitive productivity”. These kind of methods can help aid your knowledge work but I don’t think that success in this area alone can constitute for excellence when it comes to understanding things—the comprehensiveness of the methods not withstanding. The cultivation of knowledge is the objective of knowledge work and productivity workflows facilitate this effort. However I think that workflows are often confused as the either the means—or worst—the end.

    Devising a productive system of learning does not bring one any closer to the discovery and recognition of Truth. But it can help keep you consistent on the journey. This is similar to the path of spritual reformation in Islam. For example, a seeker may be prescribed or adopt practices in addition to the obligatory and customary acts of worship. But these auxiliary practices in and of themselves do not bring them closer to their ultimate objective (viz. salvation in the afterlife).

  • @s41f said:
    I encourage whoever is reading this to check out S.S. Seward’s Note-taking (available free on Google Books). He anticipates the concept of atomicity when he instructs the reader to capture the idea of a curious portion of a text or lecture. That’s all the principle of atomicity is about. Capturing ideas. Not a summary, or an enumeration of facts and the secondary details pertinent to an idea but the special discrete points that the author is trying to communicate throughout the text.

    Nice recommendation! (It is also available via the internet archive: https://archive.org/details/cu31924012997627/page/n3/mode/2up if you want to download it in various formats. It is public domain)

    Knowledge building blocks give you a mental bank of the type of ideas you that you find in a text. The stages of an atomic note are just ways to track the development of an idea—from a speculative bit of information into a concrete intimation that affects how you think and behave after its registered in your mind as correct.

    Yes! I made a connection with what you wrote further down: Knowledge Building Blocks give you an external reference point if you got the idea right. (Just an addition to what your wrote)

    @Nick said:
    Impulse of creating/notes without directly moving to a later stage of maturity seems dangerous to me. Getting into Collector's Fallacy territory. This reminds me of how the brain generates an overabundance of neurons and synapses then prunes them to become more efficient. I think the worry is if you spend to much time in impulses than you never get around to pruning and aren’t particularly efficient. I’d say a certain level of efficiency is necessary due to our limited time/energy on this planet. Why do I say all this? Because impulsing without pruning or maturation feels good (collectors fallacy).

    Only taking notes on things that you intend to advance according to an implicit timeline sounds dangerous too. Like Sascha, I think this disrupts an inherently internal phenomenon by introducing external stakes.

    To add to that: External stake to the internal process could be translated to: You put public pressure on your private sphere. It is absolutely not correct to make this translation, but it echoes the problem of specific restrictions.

    This is speculative: If you only pursue for what you already have a plan, you might become less creative because creativity is dependent on a more open-ended, playful attitude.

    This is something that inhibited my own processes in the past. I reckon as of late that efficient impulses are a matter of taste—being able to distinguish what bits of information are relevant to your broader research and anticipating their usefulness. This is where having a “toolbox of building blocks” comes in handy. Luc B. Beaudoin’s CUP’A method is a terrific heuristic for processing information. I use Notenik to store my knowledge base and it gives you different ways to view your collection of note files in the UI. With the Status field I can store the stages of my notes as numerical values and sort them. This is just an example of ways you can track the progress of notes made on an impulse. Although I must confess, I can’t think of any note of my own that wasn’t conceived like this.

    @Sascha said:
    Your stages seem to be on the level of workflow. I oriented myself by the maturation stages in practical knowledge work.

    I think this is one of the strongest distinctions to make when talking about knowledge work. Productivity is one thing with its own set of practices and interests. “Practical knowledge work” (researching, note-taking, composing, publishing) is another. Atomic note-taking is an epistemic framework or a toolkit for working with knowledge. Something than your workflow can adapt to. I find that Nick’s reservations with impulsive notes are addressed here and in the broader section from where this passage originates:

    There is no rule about the timeline when a note has to mature. You can start recording your thinking in your 20s, continue through your 30s, complete your first draft in your 40s, refine it through your 50s, and finally bring the idea to fruition in your 60s. Is this too outlandish for your taste? What about starting to write in the evening, being interrupted, and finishing the note the next morning? This is a perfectly normal development: otherwise, we’d have to assume that while we slept, our Zettelkasten was in an impure state, that leaving it in the evening breached protocol, and that it returned to purity only the next morning when we finished the note. I think that’s ridiculous.

    The Zettelkasten Method as a whole seems impartial to any one productivity method. Bring your own. Sascha’s integration of BASB into his own system gave me some insight into this.

    Yes, exactly!

    What we’re looking to achieve with our notes is made straightforward in this piece:

    1. Facilitate thinking
    2. [Take] a snapshot of your thinking, and observe it
    3. Capture individual ideas as building blocks for future efforts

    When it comes to cultivating knowledge I don’t think empirical data is always an appropriate metric for efficiency.

    Resources like “SuperMemo Guru” appear inclined toward productivity. Beaudoin has a term that I’m fond of, “Cognitive productivity”. These kind of methods can help aid your knowledge work but I don’t think that success in this area alone can constitute for excellence when it comes to understanding things—the comprehensiveness of the methods not withstanding. The cultivation of knowledge is the objective of knowledge work and productivity workflows facilitate this effort. However I think that workflows are often confused as the either the means—or worst—the end.

    You will be quoted. This is exactly it!

    Devising a productive system of learning does not bring one any closer to the discovery and recognition of Truth. But it can help keep you consistent on the journey. This is similar to the path of spritual reformation in Islam. For example, a seeker may be prescribed or adopt practices in addition to the obligatory and customary acts of worship. But these auxiliary practices in and of themselves do not bring them closer to their ultimate objective (viz. salvation in the afterlife).

    I am a Zettler

  • I appreciate the comments.

    @Sascha

    You put public pressure on your private sphere. [...]

    >

    This is speculative: If you only pursue for what you already have a plan, you might become less creative because creativity is dependent on a more open-ended, playful attitude.

    This captures the tension perfect and may additionally result in one pursuing less ambitious work/research. Of course this implies a certain level of control over your work/output that may escape a lot of people. I found Cal Newport’s Slow Productivity a useful read in general but I felt like it makes this assumption. Indeed it may be a privilege overall, to be so good you can afford to work slow and deep.

    Ah! Still I dream.

  • edited October 2025

    I did it — I have reviewed and processed the essay, the video, and the discussion.
    A lot of work, and there would be a lot to say.

    The short answer is that this is a very meaningful and relevant work.
    In my view, it is essentially the transposition of bottom-up object-oriented development — taken from software development and brought into idea development. The process is especially evident in the video.

    It seems to me that this work marks a major evolution in the theme of atomicity.
    It addresses some of the limits of the simple model of “one idea per note.” It presents tools for achieving atomicity in a rational way, as well as techniques to avoid fragmentation.
    The video, in particular, is a powerful example — not only of how atomization can be done, but of how general Zettelkasten work can be done. A pure organic development, very similar to how, in software development, a cluster of classes, objects, modules emerges from a coding task. That use of refactoring is exactly how I see Zettelkasten (and in fact, thanks to my background as a developer, that’s how the model of atomicity came to me “naturally”).

    One observation I can make — a possible completion of the work — would be to better explain why pursuing atomization is worthwhile. That would make the value of the effort clearer. Understanding ideas better, clarifying them, and being able to make connections are only three of many benefits.
    I’ll just mention a few (non-exhaustive list):

    • greater reusability of atomic ideas compared to complex conglomerates
    • greater ability to establish connections and recombinations
    • greater reactivity and generativity of new ideas in our minds (small, precise ideas are more stimulating)
    • greater recall ability
    • beneficial effects on memory
    • developed modularity that allows for composability into more complex models starting from elementary ideas
    • high flexibility resulting from modularity compared to the fragility of monoliths. Just compare a wire mesh to a concrete wall. This effect is strategic in software development — much of the effort is aimed at creating flexible, non-fragile networks that can be modified locally without breaking apart.

    I see a potential critical point in the block-based model, which should probably be discussed more deeply.
    Perhaps there’s too much implicit focus on the structural properties of the blocks for retrieving the architecture of ideas, and less on their ability to express creativity, taste, subjectivity, and personal perspectives. Of course, the article does not exclude this possibility in any way, but it might be worth emphasizing it explicitly. Not only can I “capture the truth,” but I can also “interpret” or have my own perspective.
    When we talk about blocks, patterns, and structures, it’s very easy to be distracted by their formal and representative properties — while subjectivity, which distinguishes Zettelkasten from other models, risks being overlooked. For example, if I have a “model block” or an “argument block,” it’s easy to end up expressing only the descriptive part of the model, capturing the idea "as it is" from the source.
    In the last minutes of the video, you briefly mention your personal reason for using that dynamic about IQ — it’s a short but very important moment to me. Presented so briefly, it might not be perceived as fundamental.

    In general, despite the soundness of the atom-based model, or its block-based evolution as you’ve shown, over time I find it easier to introduce the concept of atomicity using the photography metaphor rather than the atomic one.
    In the future, when asked to explain it, I think I’ll rely more on photographic metaphors.
    The great advantage of photography is that everyone understands it — you can bring up relatable examples of photos that “work” or don’t work:

    • A photo that’s out of focus, or where you can’t recognize the subject or meaning, or includes too much, doesn’t work — even instinctively.
    • Photos are easily understandable:
    • you can immediately tell when a photo is actually just a fragment (for example, if it cuts the subject in half, or includes it fully)
    • you can tell if the frame that defines what’s inside and what’s “left out” is appropriate
    • instinctively, you feel that a well-focused shot works and a blurry one doesn’t
    • you naturally realize that a photo capturing a scene precisely is far better than a random, confusing shot
    • if you see two different photos of the same scene, you instantly recognize that each shot carries a subjective characterization — that from the same scene you can create images with different intentions
    • The special cases you mentioned in your article (photo with background, composite idea) need to be explained as “exceptions” in the atomicity model — whereas in the photographic model, they’re naturally included (landscape photography, subject-with-background photography).

    At the same time, however, the photographic model works well for showing what works and what doesn’t, but perhaps provides fewer tools for explaining how to do it well.
    That might just be my personal limitation, since I’m much more experienced as a developer and system modeler — I master those two mindsets better than that of a photographer. I can recognize a good photo but wouldn’t be able to teach how to take one, while a good photographer could develop a sound photography based mindset for atomization. Nevertheless, simple photographic metaphors have, in the past, illuminated for me very clearly how to pursue atomicity (landscape, portrait, and so on).

    I’ve made this side discussion about photography mindset not to diminish the block-based mindset you presented, but to highlight what I believe is a valuable opportunity.
    I’m quite sure there are Zettelkasten practitioners who don’t fully feel comfortable thinking in terms of “blocks.”
    That’s fine: these people can use the same method as a “template framework,” inserting their preferred mindset (for example, the photographic metaphor) in place of the block vocabulary, while keeping the same skeleton that provides progressive modeling on four levels, organicity, refactoring and so on.
    So, if you don’t like blocks, try replacing them — keeping everything else the same — with a vocabulary of models that you resonate with more.

    Used as a framework with interchangeable mindsets, this model has a much broader scope than originally intended

    I’ve personally found as many as five different mindsets. One of these is a "making cookies" mindset :smiley:

  • edited October 2025

    In a nutshell, learning to master atomicity is like learning to master photography or OOP development.
    Same thing, same dynamics, same learning path, same "thinking in objects" once the highest level reached.
    And if someone is lucky enough to know how to do either of the latter two, I think they’ve already got a clear path ahead.

  • @andang76 said:
    I did it — I have reviewed and processed the essay, the video, and the discussion.
    A lot of work, and there would be a lot to say.

    The short answer is that this is a very meaningful and relevant work.

    Many thanks for your kind words.

    In my view, it is essentially the transposition of bottom-up object-oriented development — taken from software development and brought into idea development. The process is especially evident in the video.

    It seems to me that this work marks a major evolution in the theme of atomicity.
    It addresses some of the limits of the simple model of “one idea per note.” It presents tools for achieving atomicity in a rational way, as well as techniques to avoid fragmentation.
    The video, in particular, is a powerful example — not only of how atomization can be done, but of how general Zettelkasten work can be done. A pure organic development, very similar to how, in software development, a cluster of classes, objects, modules emerges from a coding task. That use of refactoring is exactly how I see Zettelkasten (and in fact, thanks to my background as a developer, that’s how the model of atomicity came to me “naturally”).

    Even as a non-programmer (I only learned Pascal and a bit of Delphi), I envision the process very similar to coding. The similarity stems from a specific shared pattern of information mapping that is beneath both processes. I can't summarise it enough to make it part of a post here, but to give you a preview: It has to do with the strange fact that mathematics doesn't care about nature, yet nature seems to speak math perfectly. More: I don't think that the Logical Empirism is as dead as it is proclaimed.

    The notion that knowledge is a malleable social construct is as bizarre as stating that 2+2=4 is a social construct.

    One observation I can make — a possible completion of the work — would be to better explain why pursuing atomization is worthwhile. That would make the value of the effort clearer. Understanding ideas better, clarifying them, and being able to make connections are only three of many benefits.
    I’ll just mention a few (non-exhaustive list):

    • greater reusability of atomic ideas compared to complex conglomerates
    • greater ability to establish connections and recombinations
    • greater reactivity and generativity of new ideas in our minds (small, precise ideas are more stimulating)
    • greater recall ability
    • beneficial effects on memory
    • developed modularity that allows for composability into more complex models starting from elementary ideas
    • high flexibility resulting from modularity compared to the fragility of monoliths. Just compare a wire mesh to a concrete wall. This effect is strategic in software development — much of the effort is aimed at creating flexible, non-fragile networks that can be modified locally without breaking apart.

    You are correct. This is already planned in two dimensions:

    1. Via direct reasoning like yours.
    2. By addressing the direct connection between atomicity, atomic note-taking and knowledge craftsmanship.

    I see a potential critical point in the block-based model, which should probably be discussed more deeply.
    Perhaps there’s too much implicit focus on the structural properties of the blocks for retrieving the architecture of ideas, and less on their ability to express creativity, taste, subjectivity, and personal perspectives. Of course, the article does not exclude this possibility in any way, but it might be worth emphasizing it explicitly. Not only can I “capture the truth,” but I can also “interpret” or have my own perspective.
    When we talk about blocks, patterns, and structures, it’s very easy to be distracted by their formal and representative properties — while subjectivity, which distinguishes Zettelkasten from other models, risks being overlooked. For example, if I have a “model block” or an “argument block,” it’s easy to end up expressing only the descriptive part of the model, capturing the idea "as it is" from the source.

    My focus stems likely from two sources:

    1. My observation that there is too much emphasis on "one's own voice" and "one's own view". Today, we put way too much emphasis on the subjective layer of any epistemic process. This leads to completely bizarre statements (this was a real statement!) that you don't know what arguments are to soundly capture them. Capturing the verifiable structures items of a source is the foundation of starting your own thinking process. It is similar to structuring one's life to balance pain (deliberate practice, training, long working hours, apologising, fasting, analysis) to lust (nice food, relaxation, scrolling feeds, sex, superficial reading). The vast majority of people will side with lust anyway, engagement with pain needs to be learned, accepted and maintained.
    2. If interpretation is more than just an expression of taste, it is subject to the laws of knowledge, too. How to perform an interpretation is in itself a process that should be constrained by logic.

    In the last minutes of the video, you briefly mention your personal reason for using that dynamic about IQ — it’s a short but very important moment to me. Presented so briefly, it might not be perceived as fundamental.

    I don't understand. You mean the above?

    In general, despite the soundness of the atom-based model, or its block-based evolution as you’ve shown, over time I find it easier to introduce the concept of atomicity using the photography metaphor rather than the atomic one.

    Atomicity is not a mere metaphor. My claim is that knowledge is organised in discrete building blocks that serve a specific function (taken directly from the article). Knowledge is not like atoms. Knowledge is atomic.

    The atomic model of knowledge is not a metaphor. The difference between a model and a metaphor is that a model is based on assumption about reality, a metaphor is an epistemic/didactic device to give you a feel and a rough direction to start your thinking process.

    The similarity of both introduce two fallacies:

    1. Mistake a metaphor for a model. One for example mistake the learned intuition through a metaphor with robust understanding of what is mapped. This by the way the problem of level 2 of atomicity. This is why I made the effort to point out the problematic feedback loop of influencers and audience on level 2 (which is btw. not specific to PKM/Zettelkasten. It applies to almost any domain).
    2. Mistake a model for a metaphor. This mistakes a model for just an arbitrary and exchangeable learning device. Typically, the fallacy is to "over-subjectivise" epistemic processes with phrases like "I understand XY better like this." With different metaphors you can facilitate learning experiences better for some people or even most. But these learning experiences are fundamentally different from understanding. Metaphors are heuristics and heuristics should be grounded in understanding the underlying reality (level 3). The reasons for that are found on level 4... :) (It is the iceberg model, not the iceberg metaphor)

    The photography metaphor works great as many level 2 approaches work great. However, as a metaphor it still is subject the the level 2 problems as layed out in the article.

    In the future, when asked to explain it, I think I’ll rely more on photographic metaphors.
    The great advantage of photography is that everyone understands it — you can bring up relatable examples of photos that “work” or don’t work:

    • A photo that’s out of focus, or where you can’t recognize the subject or meaning, or includes too much, doesn’t work — even instinctively.
    • Photos are easily understandable:
    • you can immediately tell when a photo is actually just a fragment (for example, if it cuts the subject in half, or includes it fully)
    • you can tell if the frame that defines what’s inside and what’s “left out” is appropriate
    • instinctively, you feel that a well-focused shot works and a blurry one doesn’t
    • you naturally realize that a photo capturing a scene precisely is far better than a random, confusing shot
    • if you see two different photos of the same scene, you instantly recognize that each shot carries a subjective characterization — that from the same scene you can create images with different intentions
    • The special cases you mentioned in your article (photo with background, composite idea) need to be explained as “exceptions” in the atomicity model — whereas in the photographic model, they’re naturally included (landscape photography, subject-with-background photography).

    At the same time, however, the photographic model works well for showing what works and what doesn’t, but perhaps provides fewer tools for explaining how to do it well.

    "Showing" would mean that you convince by providing learning experiences. The How depends on understanding the underlying learning reality.

    That might just be my personal limitation, since I’m much more experienced as a developer and system modeler — I master those two mindsets better than that of a photographer. I can recognize a good photo but wouldn’t be able to teach how to take one, while a good photographer could develop a sound photography based mindset for atomization. Nevertheless, simple photographic metaphors have, in the past, illuminated for me very clearly how to pursue atomicity (landscape, portrait, and so on).

    It seems to me that something got mixed up because of the AI-translation.

    I’ve made this side discussion about photography mindset not to diminish the block-based mindset you presented, but to highlight what I believe is a valuable opportunity.
    I’m quite sure there are Zettelkasten practitioners who don’t fully feel comfortable thinking in terms of “blocks.”

    I have to cite myself: The individual in individualisation is the specific task and not the individual person.

    I am not 100% confident in the completeness of the inventory of knowledge building blocks. But the underlying reality of knowledge isn't anything that you can avoid. Take arguments a an example: There are languages that work (first/second order logic, syllogisms, etc.). All of them are annoying if you are not in love with math. But you can use some vivid metaphor about logic and argumentation to understand it. The same is true for any knowledge building block.

    That’s fine: these people can use the same method as a “template framework,” inserting their preferred mindset (for example, the photographic metaphor) in place of the block vocabulary, while keeping the same skeleton that provides progressive modeling on four levels, organicity, refactoring and so on.
    So, if you don’t like blocks, try replacing them — keeping everything else the same — with a vocabulary of models that you resonate with more.

    Hopefully not. ;)

    I am a Zettler

  • I've split the off-topic detail discussion about photography as a kind of knowledge work:
    https://forum.zettelkasten.de/discussion/3341/photography-is-knowledge-work

    Hard to make clean cuts with the cross quotes everywhere. But interested readers can read up to here, then follow the link to continue.

    Author at Zettelkasten.de • https://christiantietze.de/

  • Models relate entities to each other and provide part-to-part relationships and part-to-whole relationships, often to map a part of reality or a fictional reality.
    @Sascha

    Thanks for the read Sascha. I am sort of confused on the models relating part-to-part/part-to-whole topic. Do you have any references to think about the topic?

    Zettler

  • @JoshA said:

    Models relate entities to each other and provide part-to-part relationships and part-to-whole relationships, often to map a part of reality or a fictional reality.
    @Sascha

    Thanks for the read Sascha. I am sort of confused on the models relating part-to-part/part-to-whole topic. Do you have any references to think about the topic?

    There are all kinds of books about modelling that I can think of. All of which address a different aspect.

    1. The part to part relationship is typically covered by all explanations and inquiries of models. A prime example is Thinking in Systems by Meadows.
    2. The part to whole relationship explanation is a little bit rarer. One aspect is the function or the role of the part in relationship to the whole. Here you might look into the critique of Luhmann's work by more activist sociologists who mix norms, hopes and values into their perspectives. One of the biggest criticisms of Luhmann's work was that he justifies existing relations of power. I think it is a confusion of the terms function and purpose.
    3. A nice entry point on how to think about the whole is Autopoiesis by Varela/Maturana.

    My thinking about models is tightly connected to my thinking about systems, which is massively influenced by Luhmann and Dietrich Dörner (tips: The Logic of Failure: Recognizing And Avoiding Error in Complex Situations).

    And just to throw it in there: One of my secret tipps: La métamorphose explosive de l'humanité by Henri Prat. If you speak French or German. I am not aware of a translation to English.

    I am a Zettler

  • Sprinkled around the forum it has been said level four is achieved:

    • when you add to the idea
    • demarcation between level 3/4 is when you create a "philosophy of X"
    • when one demonstrates skill using level 3
    • level 4 is required to create an inventory of knowledge building blocks in the first place

    I see level 4 as demonstration of mastery via application in any knowledge domain. Perhaps I'm reading into the levels too much but it does seem fruitful.

    Zettler

  • edited August 17

    Concepts in the author's words

    I'd like to share a technique I'm using to process the Complete Guide to Atomic Note-Taking. The goal is a condensed overview of the concepts in the source.

    I extract phrases from the source and group them with the related concepts. I use literal quotes, because they document the author's terminology and because they are easy to locate in their original context with full-text search. The process is iterative. After the initial round of extraction, I went repeatedly through the list, rearranged items, added/dropped/renamed concepts, added/dropped/edited the quotes. This is the result:

    • Knowledge

      • is "about connections"
      • can be created ("Our goal is to think and create knowledge.")
      • can be built, is something "that you want to build"
      • you can "use your Zettelkasten to build knowledge"
      • "is organised in discrete building blocks that serve a specific function"
      • can be described with a "pattern language"?
    • Knowledge work

      • can be "deep" ("deep knowledge work")
      • is a "craft". "You can learn it and you can train it."
      • can be mastered ("mastering knowledge craftsmanship")
    • Knowledge building blocks

      • are "the raw material of the knowledge that you want to build"
      • are "the fundamental building blocks of knowledge"
      • there is an "inventory of knowledge building blocks"
      • there are "six knowledge building blocks"
      • can be identified ("You identify the knowledge building block")
    • Atomicity

      • "refers to the idea that knowledge is made up of discrete building blocks"
      • "is good thinking manifesting in your notes"
      • "is about reaching a threshold that gives you, the note-taker, value out of the act of taking the note"
      • "is about putting one idea and one idea only on a note"
      • "means that we should aim to arrive at one note containing only one idea"
      • "is an intended outcome"
      • "is a concept that brings you into contact with the material of thinking, since we are talking about the atomicity of ideas"
    • Principle of Atomicity

      • "is a processing direction in note-taking, aiming for one knowledge building block per note"
      • "is not a rigid law, but a guiding compass"
      • "needs to be contextualised for each application"
    • Atomic Note

      • "Purely atomic notes are notes that contain exactly one knowledge building block."
      • "contains one idea": "you can’t remove something from the note without rendering the idea incomplete" and "nothing is missing from this idea"
      • "the shortest writing session that could possibly be useful"
      • are not: "short notes"
    • Thinking

      • is "the process (…) of thinking."
      • "is the action we perform with our minds"
      • can be "sound"
    • Thoughts

      • are "frozen processes (…) of thinking."
    • Ideas

      • are "the result (…) of thinking."
      • can be connected ("Connecting ideas is what we need to do …"")
      • can be "incomplete", "half-finished", "fully developed"
      • there are "stages of idea maturity"
      • can be built upon with "knowledge building methods"
      • can be classified by "worthiness of full treatment"
      • have an "essence"
      • can "resonate with you"
      • can be gotten "into direct contact with"
    • Atomic idea

      • "is the destination that you want to arrive at in your thinking journey"
      • is "the right scope" of the "components that you link" in a Zettelkasten
    • The Zettelkasten Method

      • "is about creating links", "there are components that you link"
      • "is a label for a deeper and more informed perspective on how to use the Zettelkasten to solve methodological problems"
      • "provides a thinking environment"
      • has "organizational aspects" like "tagging, choosing a good title, writing a one-sentence summary, linking with context"
    • The Zettelkasten

      • "answers the question where to put all these connected notes"
      • "container for your own notes"
      • is "a home for your mind in all its stages of idea maturity"
      • stores "your body of knowledge"?
      • can be "an integrated thinking environment"?
    • (Zettelkasten) Notes

      • have a "maturation process" with "different maturation stages" ("Thinking Stage", "Finished Thought Stage", "Idea Stage")
      • can be connected ("connected notes")
      • have a "focus"
      • have a "purpose"
      • can have a "title" and a "one-sentence summary"
      • can have "object tags"
      • can be a "structure note"
      • there are "characteristics of a proper Zettelkasten note"?
  • edited August 17

    Concepts in my own words

    In the next step I'm trying to describe the concepts in my own words. The following examples are drafts:

    • The Zettelkasten Method is a method of knowledge work.
    • A Zettelkasten is a container for a body of knowledge in form of connected notes.
    • Knowledge refers only to the content of the Zettelkasten. Knowledge does not refer to knowledge stored elsewhere.
    • Knowledge work is the process of creating knowledge by writing, editing and connecting notes.
    • Knowledge is composed of clearly distinguishable components, the so called knowledge building blocks.
    • A knowledge building blocks has exactly one of six types: concepts, arguments, counter-arguments, models, hypotheses & theories, empirical observations. The list is unlikely to change.
    • Atomicity refers to the ideal that knowledge should be made up of knowledge building blocks, even if this ideal cannot always be achieved.
    • Thinking is an ongoing cognitive activity.
    • Thoughts are units of content of thinking.
    • Ideas are thoughts that are being externalized in the Zettelkasten.
    • Atomic idea refers to the ideal form of an idea. An atomic idea is one complete knowledge building block. Nothing is missing, nothing is superfluous, everything belongs.
    • Atomic notes contain exactly one atomic idea.
    • The Principle of Atomicity guides note-writing towards atomicity.
    • Notes are the elementary structural unit of a Zettelkasten. The Zettelkasten Method recommends that notes have a title, one-sentence summary and main text. Notes can connect to other notes with links. Notes can have tags. Notes are malleable, they can change over time. Notes can be classified into atomic notes and structure notes.

    If anybody has suggestions how to modify these descriptions, so that they better capture the source's content and intention, please share!

  • @harr said:

    Concepts in my own words

    In the next step I'm trying to describe the concepts in my own words. The following examples are drafts:

    • Atomic idea refers to the ideal form of an idea. An atomic idea is one complete knowledge building block. Nothing is missing, nothing is superfluous, everything belongs.
    • Atomic notes contain exactly one atomic idea.
    • The Principle of Atomicity guides note-writing towards atomicity.
      If anybody has suggestions how to modify these descriptions, so that they better capture the source's content and intention, please share!

    I don't know this book; even so I think you are missing something that appears in Sasha's essay on atomicity on our site. And I think you are missing a chance to help these notes do more for you in the future.

    Notes don't have to atomic to begin. At the beginning you probably aren't clear enough on the concepts to even know what could be atomic. Over time (if you work at it) you get more understanding of the concepts and can start to rework the card(s). If and when the concept has become crystal clear will you be able to whittle the card down to a good atomic note.

    When one needs to write a quote for a job, one usually doesn't know enough to bid it realistically. But one has to move on it anyway. That's going to be a common situation when you are creating cards and working on their concepts.

    What about that time in between? The card isn't going to be useless, I hope. What does the book say about how to have the card be useful before it has become distilled down to atomicity? If the book has nothing to say about this, you could note in the card(s) that this subject needs to be worked on. You could - I would say should - create one or more cards to start exploring the subject.

    I suggest that you might think about whether you want to be a mason or a sculptor. Masons assemble blocks; it's an honorable profession. Then reflect this facet in the cards you are deriving from processing the book.

    "The Principle of Atomicity guides note-writing towards atomicity."

    Ok, how does that happen? Use your proposed note as a springboard to start understanding that.

    "Atomic notes contain exactly one atomic idea."

    Ok, what will be the outcome if they don't? If you put that question into that note, maybe the note will be more productive. If not, then put it into its own linked card. If you think you know, put that into the card, or start a new sequence to capture your idea.

    I have some cards much the same as your drafts, and the only thing they are good for at the moment is to remind me where I have more thinking to do, sometime if I want to spend the effort.

  • edited August 18

    Good catch. Thanks, @tomp. The Guide calls the ideal atomic note "purely atomic note". And the Principle essay describes atomicity as "desired outcome". What do you think of this?

    • Atomic idea refers to the ideal form of an idea. An atomic idea is one complete knowledge building block. Nothing is missing, nothing is superfluous, everything belongs.
    • Atomicity is the ideal, that every idea should eventually mature into an atomic idea, even if this ideal cannot always be achieved.
    • Atomic notes contain exactly one idea. The idea can be in any stage of maturation.
    • The Principle of Atomicity declares atomicity as desired outcome of note-writing.
  • @harr said:
    Good catch. Thanks, @tomp. The Guide calls the ideal atomic note "purely atomic note". And the Principle essay describes atomicity as "desired outcome". What do you think of this?

    • Atomic idea refers to the ideal form of an idea. An atomic idea is one complete knowledge building block. Nothing is missing, nothing is superfluous, everything belongs.
    • Atomicity is the ideal, that every idea should eventually mature into an atomic idea, even if this ideal cannot always be achieved.
    • Atomic notes contain exactly one idea. The idea can be in any stage of maturation.
    • The Principle of Atomicity declares atomicity as desired outcome of note-writing.

    I took a try at creating these notes myself. These are no doubt not their ultimate form but represent what I understand and the level of effort I am willing to put in right now. Here is their immediate neighborhood -

    Zettelkastens - Atomic Notes
        The Atomic Note - What?
        The Atomic Note - Why?
        The Atomic Note - When?
        The Atomic Note - How?
    

    I chose the titles because -

    • They are the classic "what, why, when, how", which seems to make sense in this context; maybe I should have added "who" to emphasize the importance of the practitioner's role and craftsmanship.
    • Their use of the term "atomic note" will make them easy to search for and bring all of them up in the same search display.
    • The form of the titles invites me to keep thinking about their cards.

    Here are the cards themselves, in the outline order -

    What Is An Atomic Note?

    :id: tom.20260817223811.1
    :created: 2026-08-17 22:38
    :seealso: tom.20260817224518.1 The Atomic Note - Why?
    :seealso: tom.20260817230424.1 The Atomic Note - When?
    :seealso: tom.20260817230940.1 The Atomic Note - How?

    Contains
    - A single, well-developed concept.
    - The outcome of thorough, well-developed understanding of the subject of interest.
    - Cannot be simplified further.

    Advocated by many writers on Zettelkasten.
    Note - Concept rarely explained clearly.
    Note - Not universally agreed to be essential principle.

    Similar to one entity in an Entity-Relationship diagram.
    - E-R diagrams are incomplete without connecting edges.
    - Similarly, notes are incomplete without links.


    The Atomic Note - Why?

    :id: tom.20260817224518.1
    :created: 2026-08-17 22:45
    :seealso: tom.20260817223811.1 The Atomic Note - What?

    • Serves as a link target.

      • No ambiguity about what concept is being linked to.
      • Useful when composing a new cognitive structure.
    • Is a marker that the concept is well-understood.

      • Card unclear if understanding is incomplete.
      • cf Feymann: can you explain concept to a middle-schooler?
      • Desire for clarity can drive thought process.

    The Atomic Note - When?

    :id: tom.20260817230424.1
    :created: 2026-08-17 23:04
    :seealso: tom.20260817223811.1 The Atomic Note - What?

    • Note most likely not atomic when created.
    • Must be useful during note evolution.
      • focus should be narrow and clear.
      • easy to understand even if not fully atomic.
      • helps with the evolution of concept understanding.
        • reminds user of thought process being evolved.

    The Atomic Note - How?

    :id: tom.20260817230940.1
    :created: 2026-08-17 23:10
    :seealso: tom.20260817223811.1 The Atomic Note - What?

    • **Purpose* of note?

      • be clear.
    • Write clearly.

    • Layout and format important for

      • understanding
      • leading thinking
    • Use cognitive science, e.g.:

      • chunking.
      • retrieval cues.
      • rhythm.
    • Other media useful.

      • e.g. mind maps, concept diagrams.
      • creating, reviewing other media stimulates new understanding.
      • link to them from within the note
        • may not be feasible.
    • Expect note to evolve.

    • Aim for fully atomic character.

      • May or may not be achieved.
    • Write good titles

      • show topic of note at a glance.
      • makes search better.
      • helps to create neighborhoods of related notes.
      • sequence of note titles should help sequence of related thought.
    • Most notes are not

      • catalog entries.
      • documentation

    The whole process including writing and editing this post took me about 40 minutes.

  • @tomp said:

    I took a try at creating these notes myself. These are no doubt not their ultimate form but represent what I understand and the level of effort I am willing to put in right now. Here is their immediate neighborhood -

    Zettelkastens - Atomic Notes
        The Atomic Note - What?
        The Atomic Note - Why?
        The Atomic Note - When?
        The Atomic Note - How?
    

    [snip, snip, snip]

    Before I wrote these cards, I was pretty sick of the whole subject. I had no interest in creating any new cards about Atomicity ever again. As I got into it I got interested all over again, and I came to understand the ideas better than before. I also for nearly the first time deliberately created a sequence of titles that is not a Folgezetel, with the specific intent of creating a trail that could pull my mind along. I enjoyed applying some of the principles of card craftsmanship I have been advocating.

    So the ZK was doing its job - promoting my thinking, interest, and understanding.

    I was eating my own dog food, as the saying goes.

  • edited August 18

    @tomp said:
    I was eating my own dog food, as the saying goes.

    Haven't heard that saying in while. It captures nicely what I miss.

    * * *

    Can you imagine a Zettelkasten about The Zettelkasten Method, that implements The Zettelkasten Method? In my imagination it would be a clickable hypertext system such as Andy Matuschak's working notes, but it would also apply all the conventions of The Zettelkasten Method. It would look like The Archive. Every note would be an atomic note (or a structure note?). Atomic notes would contain only one idea. You'd navigate the Zettelkasten by clicking on links. It would contain indexes and support object tags. etc.

    One can dream. :-)

    * * *

    Back on Earth I find it interesting how you intentionally create a "neighourhood". I think that your example illustrates that outlines are of practical value in a digital zettelkasten and that the outliner paradigm works well for a digital zettelkasten. But that might be a topic for a separate thread.

    * * *

    I've also examined the concept atomic note in my Zettelkasten, but I didn't get anywhere. So I'm trying out something new here.

    When I reread the Guide, I noticed how the various concepts depend on each other. This is one of my favorite passages in the Guide:

    Atomic notes are notes that contain a single idea. If you have no idea what an idea is, this sentence doesn’t mean anything.

    I agree. Rereading the Guide, I noticed how closely the concept idea is linked to concepts like knowledge building block and thought.

    So I'm extracting all the relevant concepts, instead of just one.

    Seeing all those concepts as a concise list, makes it easier for me to understand them individually and how they depend on each other.

  • edited August 18

    Here's an updated list of concepts found in the Guide:

    • The Zettelkasten Method is a method of knowledge work.
    • A Zettelkasten is a container for a body of knowledge in form of connected notes.
    • Knowledge refers only to the content of the Zettelkasten. Knowledge does not refer to knowledge stored elsewhere.
    • Knowledge work is the process of creating knowledge by writing, editing and connecting notes.
    • Knowledge is composed of clearly distinguishable components, the so called knowledge building blocks.
    • A knowledge building block has exactly one of six types: concepts, arguments, counter-arguments, models, hypotheses & theories, empirical observations. The list is unlikely to change.
    • Thinking is an ongoing cognitive activity.
    • Thoughts are units of content of thinking.
    • Ideas are thoughts that are being externalized in the Zettelkasten.
    • Atomic idea refers to the ideal form of an idea. An atomic idea is one complete knowledge building block. Nothing is missing, nothing is superfluous, everything belongs.
    • Atomicity is the ideal, that every idea should eventually mature into an atomic idea, even if this ideal cannot always be achieved.
    • Atomic notes are notes that contain a single idea. The idea can be in any stage of maturation.
    • The Principle of Atomicity declares atomicity as desired outcome of note-writing.
    • Notes are the elementary structural unit of a Zettelkasten. The Zettelkasten Method recommends that notes have a title, one-sentence summary and main text. Notes can connect to other notes with links. Notes can have tags. Notes are malleable, they can change over time. Notes can be classified into atomic notes and structure notes.

    Note: I wrapped the list with <details> … </details>.

  • edited August 18

    Just for fun, trying out alternatives, one might say:

    An idea is a thought put into writing.

  • @harr said:

    @tomp said:
    I was eating my own dog food, as the saying goes.

    Haven't heard that saying in while. It captures nicely what I miss.

    * * *

    Can you imagine a Zettelkasten about The Zettelkasten Method, that implements The Zettelkasten Method? In my imagination it would be a clickable hypertext system such as Andy Matuschak's working notes, but it would also apply all the conventions of The Zettelkasten Method. It would look like The Archive. Every note would be an atomic note (or a structure note?). Atomic notes would contain only one idea. You'd navigate the Zettelkasten by clicking on links. It would contain indexes and support object tags. etc.

    One can dream. :-)
    [snip.
    So I'm extracting all the relevant concepts, instead of just one.

    My friend, I'm afraid you are being lured into analysis paralysis. You seem to be "extracting" for its own sake, or as an exercise in trying out a "method". But what a ZK is good for, if you allow it, is to help you develop and clarify ideas (whatever they might be). Not extract content, but to help you.

    What you propose will take a long time. What will help a lot is to memorialize your intermediate understanding while you keep working. At this time, the best thing a card can do for you is to keep the concepts and their relationships alive so *that you can do your work better.

    When you are done (but the work never truly gets done), the cards will remind you of the whole and the parts, which will otherwise fade over time. Not as a matter of cataloging or PKM practices, but as a way of bringing it all back to life.

    If you write catalog cards, you will get a PKM. If you write card sequences that can bring the concepts and their interconnections back to light, you will get a Zettelkasten. Yes, I know, "what do you mean by a Zettelkasten?". Well, now you know what I think.

    Here is a new card I have written in the "Atomic Notes" series.

    The Atomic Note - Importance of Scale

    :id: tom.20260818092841.1
    :created: 2026-08-18 09:29

    • A concept's unity depends on scale:

      • For a general planning a deployment, the unit is a division or army.

        • For the unit chaplain, the unit is an individual soldier.
      • For a medical student, units may be nerves, muscles, and organs.

      • Light Bulb example
        • For homeowner, unit is a lightbulb
        • For the lightbulb designer. units might be components of the lightbulb
        • For the lighbulb sales person, units might be pallets of bulbs
    • Pursuing a very small scale can be counter-productive

      • Can lead to analysis paralysis.
    • But what about future needs?

      • Foresee what you can;
      • Build for now, try to accomodate what you can foresee.
  • @tomp said:
    [snip]
    Here is a new card I have written in the "Atomic Notes" series.
    The Atomic Note - Importance of Scale
    [snip]

    As I look over my card series, I am struck by that fact that it has taken 5 cards (so far) to talk about the "atomic note" idea, and there is obviously more that could be said.

    So the idea of the atomic note is not atomic. No wonder people have trouble defining and expressing it! For the most part, they haven't been able to clarify it for themselves enough yet. The work hasn't been taken to the point of conceptual clarity.

  • @tomp said:

    @tomp said:
    [snip]
    Here is a new card I have written in the "Atomic Notes" series.
    The Atomic Note - Importance of Scale
    [snip]

    As I look over my card series, I am struck by that fact that it has taken 5 cards (so far) to talk about the "atomic note" idea, and there is obviously more that could be said.

    So the idea of the atomic note is not atomic. No wonder people have trouble defining and expressing it! For the most part, they haven't been able to clarify it for themselves enough yet. The work hasn't been taken to the point of conceptual clarity.

    I created these cards as part of my endeavor to gain clarity to the point where I could share my understanding with members of this thread. Mentally writing these posts brought be some clarity. Crafting the cards helped bring more. Being able to refer back to the cards helped the whole structure stay alive even while it was developing. At the end point (such as it is so far), I even let the cards speak directly to you. I hope they spoke clearly enough.

    Do you see how there is no "Method" I am following here? It is an interactive process between me and my ZK (and with the thread and with you) and my intent and my desire for clarity and understanding.

    In the long run, these cards will have value if they can bring this whole mental scene back to me.

  • @tomp said:

    @tomp said:

    @tomp said:
    [snip]
    Here is a new card I have written in the "Atomic Notes" series.
    The Atomic Note - Importance of Scale
    [snip]

    As I look over my card series, I am struck by that fact that it has taken 5 cards (so far) to talk about the "atomic note" idea, and there is obviously more that could be said.

    Notice that I did not include any link in this last card. Horrors! Not so fast: my system is based on an outliner, and the card is automatically linked via the outline. The outline is very malleable so I'm not locked in.

  • edited August 18

    @tomp said:

    So I'm extracting all the relevant concepts, instead of just one.

    My friend, I'm afraid you are being lured into analysis paralysis. You seem to be "extracting" for its own sake, or as an exercise in trying out a "method".

    No. I think of the technique as an exercise in reading comprehension. Classic reading tutorials like Adler & Doren's How to Read a Book recommend similar approaches:

    • find the key words in a text
    • learn how the author is using them

    The result is what you see in an earlier comment. In my Zettelkasten I saved it in a source note about the Guide.

    OK, there's a bit more to it. The Guide is a complex text that uses it's own terminology. For example, atomic idea or knowledge building block have very specific meanings in this text. The challenge is to extract those specific meanings from the text. I was showcasing a simple technique that worked for me, ie collecting and grouping literal quotes.

    @tomp said:
    But what a ZK is good for, if you allow it, is to help you develop and clarify ideas (whatever they might be). Not extract content, but to help you.

    That's a different goal. I've suffered a severe case of analysis paralysis when I tried to write meaningful zettels about atomic notes. :-) I've learned from this and similar experiences, that sometimes I better choose smaller goals and use simpler tools.

    @tomp said:
    What you propose will take a long time.

    Not sure what you mean. I'm already done. I'll update the list, when I get feedback here in the forum, learn something new or change my mind. :-)

    @tomp said:
    If you write catalog cards, you will get a PKM.

    What is a catalog card? I'm not familiar with the term.

    @tomp said:
    If you write card sequences that can bring the concepts and their interconnections back to light, you will get a Zettelkasten. Yes, I know, "what do you mean by a Zettelkasten?". Well, now you know what I think.

    No need to rehash the "What is a Zettelkasten" debate. :-) In this thread here I'm only interested in understanding the Guide.

    @tomp said:
    So the idea of the atomic note is not atomic. No wonder people have trouble defining and expressing it! For the most part, they haven't been able to clarify it for themselves enough yet. The work hasn't been taken to the point of conceptual clarity.

    In the context of the thread here, I'm only interested in trying to understand, how the Guide defines atomicity.

    @tomp said:
    Do you see how there is no "Method" I am following here? It is an interactive process between me and my ZK (and with the thread and with you) and my intent and my desire for clarity and understanding.

    If I understand the Guide's terminology correctly, you might be using The Zettelkasten Method to "create knowledge".

    Post edited by harr on
  • @harr said:

    In the context of the thread here, I'm only interested in trying to understand, how the Guide defines atomicity.

    I'm wondering why you want to do that, in the context of enhancing your ZK. It seems to me that what would matter, in that context, is to clarify your own understanding, and ripple that into the ZK.

  • edited August 19

    @tomp said:

    In the context of the thread here, I'm only interested in trying to understand, how the Guide defines atomicity.

    I'm wondering why you want to do that, in the context of enhancing your ZK. It seems to me that what would matter, in that context, is to clarify your own understanding, and ripple that into the ZK.

    I want to stay on-topic. This thread is attached to the Guide. The topic of this thread is the Guide: a text about atomic note-taking. The text talks about atomicity in a specific way. In this thread I'm interested in such specifics, because I want to understand the text. Identifying and understanding key concepts of the text is part of the process. My goal here is to understand the text.

    Post edited by harr on
  • @harr said:

    @tomp said:

    In the context of the thread here, I'm only interested in trying to understand, how the Guide defines atomicity.

    I'm wondering why you want to do that, in the context of enhancing your ZK. It seems to me that what would matter, in that context, is to clarify your own understanding, and ripple that into the ZK.

    I want to stay on-topic. This thread is attached to the Guide. The topic of this thread is the Guide: a text about atomic note-taking. The text talks about atomicity in a specific way. In this thread I'm interested in such specifics, because I want to understand the text. Identifying and understanding key concepts of the text is part of the process. My goal here is to understand the text.

    Ah, I see. I read books of that sort mainly to learn something new or to see if my own thinking needs some updating. The results might add to my note collection along the way.

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