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Comments
I found two other horizontal outliners with a column view: Tree (discontinued) and Dashword. They are not as elegant as Gingko, though.
The commercial Obsidian plugin Branch Writing looks a lot like Gingko. This is an experiment with transcripts of Luhmann's branch ZK II 9/8. For other visualization experiments with that branch see this post.
Love it!!! I will definitely try it out the plugin.
This plugin looks helpful for arranging knowledge units, but it looks like it requires a single file underneath. Maybe a single parent/topic/structure card for each entry? Possible the use of transclusions could assist with separating out each zettel.
Yes, that's exactly how it works. It renders a single Markdown file as a Gingko-style outline.
A "perfect" ZK app would use the same layout to render multiple notes. It would look like this plugin but use data more similarly to the plugin VirtFolder.
I did use transclusions in this example. How did you know? ;-)
A "perfect" ZK app would have to scale much better. It should be able manage tens of thousands of notes in such a view.
The plugin is fun, because you can use a Gingko-style interaction pattern within Obsidian. It's a first glimpse of how a new kind of ZK app could look like.
I think that a "perfect" ZK app should support an outliner view. Maybe even two: the Gingko-style view and the more familiar nested list?
I would add a mind map view as well.
Yes. I have experience with mind map apps that show the same data as mind map and as outline. I like to switch between the two views, depending on the task. The outline is pure structure. The mind map adds something extra that is difficult to put in words.
I agree with the desirability of visual simulation, and the examples given are cool, but a tree view, outline view, or mindmap view, while useful, are still too constraining.
A large advantage of a paper Zettelkasten is that you can pull out notes from anywhere in the Kasten (so not only the Folgezettel structure you happen to be looking at), and arrange them on a desk, or re-arrange them. In this way you let go of the constraints of the Folgezettel structure and you can use the visualization as a thinking tool. For example to create a new hub Zettel or a new structure Zettel or to create “long links”.
About 15 years ago I saw a demo video of Microsoft surface technology that promised to do something like that. It was large - desk size - and you would be able to extract documents, put them next to each other, or on a heap, or partly on top of each other, like you can do with paper on a real desk. Alas the technology did not develop in that direction and it is very different from what they are now selling.
And, of course, even if this could be done, it would likely require substantial computing power. With The Archive, @ctietze and @Sascha made a different trade-off toward speed and compactness, and there is a lot to be said for that. You don’t want to sit around waiting for your notes to load. The price to pay is that you have to keep the Zettel landscape in your mind, as @Sascha explained in his earlier post in this thread. Even then, I often find myself with two TA screens and sometimes 5-6 tabs open to link a new note to different existing structures.
As an aside, an interesting alternative software doing the outline structure is Kosshi (see the review of macosxguru on https://bicycleforyourmind.com/kosshi-is-database-backed-outlining. It is a single-database outliner, very snappy, and it can be perfectly used as a Zettelkasten. I tried it, the entry and rearrangement of notes is very intuitive, ideal for Folgezettel structures. It doesn’t import/export text files well though, and of course there are questions on how it works at large scales and whether it will still be around in ten years time.
For now, TA remains by far my favorite app, and it is highly recommended for a Zettelkasten of course
I completely agree with this. It's not hard to do if you don't insist on automatic layout. Any automatic layout could only be a starting point, of course, because the computer cannot know what you are thinking about nor what arrangement would work best for you in a given moment.
It shouldn't take much all that much computing power. It is best if the notes that are spread out are also editable right in the spread out view. It is also desirable that any graphics or other media files that are linked in a note also are be able to be spread out along with the notes proper. My Zettelkasten system can already do this, though the spread out notes aren't as compact as they could be.
They are just a few of many more options. Are you aware of the many apps, that use an infinite canvas? For example https://infinitecanvas.tools
Yes.
Why not do both? You can use Folgezettel (if it make's sense for you) and manually arrange selected cards on an infinite canvas as needed.
Do you mean Microsoft's PixelSense? That looked amazing.
The computing power shouldn't be an issue anymore, considering what you can do today with smartphones, tablets or VR headsets.
I think the limiting factor is the lack of UI concepts that work for many zettels. What do you think of Scrintal?
I find this one is interesting, because it shows how one can recombine well-known technology and UI concepts in ever novel ways, depending on what you prioritize. Kosshi reminds me of Taskpaper, Bike or Roam. Sometimes it's only one specific aspect that lets people choose one app over the other.
@harr said
and
Interesting collection of apps!
The usual reservations apply:
Still, if there would be an app that plays nice with my single-folder collection of text files, I’d be more than willing (and pay) to try it out.
@harr said
Yes, that was it. Alas it wasn’t further developed.
@harr said
Indeed! I use both Folgezettel and Structurenotes (for different purposes).
Have you tried Obsidian? It handles tens of thousands of files easily, even on mobile devices.
No need for third-party plugins. Out-of-the-box features go a long way. You might like Canvas as an infinite canvas where you can place your existing notes as you like and Bases for extremely fast queries of your files.
Obsidian uses the same file-first approach as The Archive. But they have the opposite design philosophy in terms of features. Obsidian is maximalist and complex. TA is minimalist and lightweight.
Because Obsidian and TA both work with text files, you should be able to use both apps with the same files.
Obsidian can be very frustrating in the beginning. There's a lot to learn. And some deceivingly simple looking features reveal their true power only to the experienced user. Expect a steep learning curve. ;-)
Yes! And mostly likely, I have what you want my friend
. I just developed an app you can try right now. My app do it without problems! 
My ZettelKasten App for you!
Also, my app handle this without any aproblems, no matter if you have 5,000 - 10,000 notes, it will be always fluid and will process it all perfect.
My app is free and Offline, you no need server, no need subscription, no need to pay.
My app can be migrated to Obsidian whenever you want. It exports/import Markdown, so you can save your connections and migrate them without issues
You can try my app!
Thank you @Ryuk !
I’ll give it a try.
@harr said
Hadn’t done so before, but checking it out again.