How do you find notes and chain of thoughts without backlinks?

IvanPsy · February 19

Hi all,
I've read lots of threads here about whether backlinks are good or bad, and I'd like to hear from the experience of the more
seasoned ZK users.

How do you find notes and chain of thoughts without backlinks, when your ZK grows up?

TL;DR

My ZK is about 455 notes (some atomic, some literature, etc...).
I'm finding backlinks very useful right now: sometimes I don't remember how to find a note, but I remember a linked note, so
I go to the linked note and, thanks to the backlink, I find the note I was looking for.

But reading your past threads a question arose in my mind: what happens when my ZK grows bigger, say hundreds or
thousands notes?

Furthermore, I realise that the more I get accustomed to backlinks, the more I'm dependent on specific tools such as Obsidian (not all Markdown editors have backlinks).
My goal is to have the most versatile system as possible, that it means: only Markdown text.

That is, I'd like to move to IA Writer, that I like much more: it has wikilcnks, but not backlinks.

Hope it makes sense.

Thank you!

IvanFerrero · February 19

(I've realised I've published the thread from an account I created by mistake, and that I can't delete because I'm not able to find the option. I write this comment only to get the notifications on the right email address)

GeoEng51 · February 19

@IvanPsy I rely on tags and structure notes. I do use "backlinks" infrequently, but only when I think the link should go both ways (for whatever reason). So I don't really think of them as backlinks. My tag system is organized and specific, which simplifies finding zettels. For example, see:

https://forum.zettelkasten.de/discussion/comment/19044#Comment_19044

Will · February 19

@IvanFerrero, I'm surely not the "seasoned" user you were hoping would reply, but I do have an opinion.

Terminology matters. I don't like the idea of special "backlinks". I prefer the idea of tiers of connectivity. The first tier would be links directly in the note. The second tier would be those notes with links to the first tier note. There are more tiers as you get deeper and deeper until you get to a tier that encompasses your entire ZK.

We use The Archive, which handles the first and second-tier links eloquently with the note list.

In this example, you can see the target note has both of the first-tier linked notes and five notes that are on the second tier. They are essentially what you call backlinks. In my workflow, these links get created over time. This list will grow if this idea thread maintains my attention.

IvanFerrero · February 20

@GeoEng51 said:
My tag system is organized and specific, which simplifies finding zettels

Thank you for your reply.
Tags is something I barely took under consideration because I thought they were too much generic, but I like your system.

Worth considering.

IvanFerrero · February 20

@Will said:

Terminology matters. I don't like the idea of special "backlinks". I prefer the idea of tiers of connectivity. The first tier would be links directly in the note. The second tier would be those notes with links to the first tier note. There are more tiers as you get deeper and deeper until you get to a tier that encompasses your entire ZK.

Thank you for your reply, and I like your terminology.

Indeed, if we think of links, backlinks and bidirectional links (or whatever) as different tiers, than it makes sense: now we can choose accordingly the tier we need...or that we don't need a specific tier at all in our system.

Here an example of what I mean for "backlinks", I don't know which tier they refer to:

Will · February 20

Maybe I understand what you mean by "Linked mentions." Those notes that have a link reference to this target note. In the wonderous and across-the-board brilliant software, The Archive, the note list that appears on the left is full of all the linked mentions for quick access and reference. (See the screenshot in my previous post.)

andang76 · February 20

I use Obsidian too.

In my practice I've developed the idea that (automatic) backlinking is a "weak" linking model that I can't use as the main linking model in my note system.

But this doesn't mean that I can't use Obsidian backlinking as a tool that supports me discovering and making manual links, in some cases.
Backlinking, just like making clusters of notes using tagging, can help to discover relationships between notes in a not well mature set of notes (written at the beginning of a new subject, for example). Once discovered, some of the "automatic" links can be promoted to first class links, thing that help to make notes finally more mature.

In my Obsidian automatic backlinking is disabled by default. But when I'm into a note and I'm "feel lost", I activate backlinking panel and take a look at the picture of links and this can help to form chains. It's like a compass.

More generally, anyway, using and maintaining structure notes makes much less necessary the need of that compass. The structure note closest to the note I'm making often acts as the needed compass and already contains part of the chain of thought done previously.

IvanFerrero · February 22

@andang76 said:
In my practice I've developed the idea that (automatic) backlinking is a "weak" linking model that I can't use as the main linking model in my note system.
...
But this doesn't mean that I can't use Obsidian backlinking as a tool that supports me discovering and making manual links, in some cases.

Indeed, I agree: it's a weak linking model.
Nothing to die for, but it comes very handy.

Following up your inspiring insights, I have peace of mind about backlinks.

I see many softwares support it, so I don't bother about future proofing my System.
And even if I'd choose another software that doesn't support them, it doesn't matter because they're not an essential part of my strategy: they're only something that eases my life.

More generally, anyway, using and maintaining structure notes makes much less necessary the need of that compass. The structure note closest to the note I'm making often acts as the needed compass and already contains part of the chain of thought done previously.

I see.
My ZK is very young, but the more I use it, the more I find myself creating structured notes in order to give meaning to the atomic notes.

In this scenario, backlinks are becoming more and more simple tools to ease my searchings.

DataDisk · April 8

I’m completely new to this so I’m wondering; does The Archive allow for creating backlinks or not?

ZettelDistraction · April 8

For me, a "backlink" is an ordinary forward link to a particular type of Zettel visited to see what else links there. Those special Zettels are usually index Zettels and category or hub Zettels otherwise. The mechanism works in Zettlr and Obsidian, like the "what links here" pages in Wikimedia.

The Zettelkasten can be indexed "for free" using the Zettels index, as follows: choose some Zettels other than an index Zettel as "entry points" into the Zettelkasten. Add one or more WikiLinks to an index Zettel containing the first letter of one or more words of the title of the Zettel. This creates an index of entry-point Zettels, distributed over the index Zettels, visible from the "Related files" pane of Zettlr and the analogous file pane in Obsidian. A judicious choice of entry-point Zettels will keep the index from becoming cluttered.

Here is the latest version of my self-documenting Zettel template. It includes features I had previously sworn off, such as structure notes and YAML frontmatter. (I'm close to getting rid of Folgezettel in favor of up to five-letter keywords followed by a timestamp.) The complete list of index Zettels is given in the SEE ALSO section.

---
# Version: 2024.02.28.1
# This self-documenting Zettel template specifies the format of 
# a Zettel suitable for a digital Zettelkasten. The Zettel is
# organized as a Markdown file, beginning with this YAML 
# frontmatter followed by self-documenting Markdown sections 
# in the order of presentation. The YAML frontmatter contains
# commands to Zettlr, Pandoc, and Obsidian and includes, 
# at minimum, the following variables: `title:` and 
# `reference-section-title:` 

title: "ZTEMP.1.0.24.0228 Zettel Template"

# The value of the `title:` variable is a quoted string, 
# consisting of a unique, immutable ID, in this case 
# `ZTEMP.1.0.24.0228`, followed by the Zettel title, in this case
# "Zettel Template" Immutable, unique IDs may have 
# different formats, according to personal preference. 
# Timestamps are a popular choice, followed by Folgezettel. 

reference-section-title: References

# The `reference-section-title:` variable is a command to Pandoc.
# If Zettel is exported through Pandoc and the Zettel body includes 
# Pandoc-style citations, the `reference-section-title:` variable 
# will cause Pandoc to add a References section with citations to the
# end of the exported document. 
---

ZTEMP.1.0.24.0228 Zettel Template

The Zettel body begins an H1 header. In my system, the H1 header duplicates the immutable, unique ID and title with the following syntax; however, this choice is optional.

# immutableID title

Titles aren't immutable, unlike IDs. The Zettel body ends immediately before the SEE ALSO section below.

Customization notes

This section guides personalizing your Zettel template. Adjust these elements to suit your note-taking preferences and workflow. For example, while this template places the immutable ID to the left of the title, some users prefer it to the right.

Definitions

Reference Element Types

WikiLink: A markdown link used within Zettels to interlink them within the Zettelkasten system. It is enclosed in double square brackets and typically includes a unique identifier followed by the title of the linked Zettel.
Title-only WikiLink: This format includes the WikiLink followed immediately by the title of the linked Zettel without additional annotations or explanations, adhering strictly to the format: [[UniqueID]] Zettel Title.
Hashtags: Hashtags are for thematic categorization and quick reference within your Zettelkasten. Hashtags typically occur in the SEE ALSO section of a Zettel.
Pandoc citations: Pandoc citations have the form [@citeKey], where citeKey is a citation Key for a citation maintained within a digital references management system such as Zotero or a manually created and maintained reference database.

Types of Notes in Zettelkasten

Single-focus Zettels: Focus on one main idea or topic for clarity and precision. Single-focus Zettels form the core of the Zettelkasten.
Structure Notes: Outline and connect Single-focus Zettels under broader themes. They contain sections with annotated WikiLinks to individual Zettels.
Index Notes: Serve as navigational tools within the Zettelkasten, marked by IDs starting with 0000.0000.0 and typically annotated with their title only.

More on customization

The list of title-only WikiLinks in the SEE ALSO section is just a starting point. Feel free to modify these links or hashtags to organize your notes better.

Revised Zettel Construction Guidelines

ID and Title:
- Start with a unique ID and clear title for each Zettel to ensure clarity and retrievability.
Main Body:
- Prioritize writing Zettels with the author's future self in mind, emphasizing clarity and utility for the author rather than a general reader.
- Single-focus Zettels: Maintain a strict focus on one main idea or topic, crafting content for future clarity and utility. Annotate WikiLinks where they contribute to the topic's context, except for Index Note references. Links within the main body of a Single-focus Zettel should be directly related to the Zettel's central theme or idea and provide immediate, contextual support by offering additional information, evidence, or related viewpoints directly relevant to the Zettel's focus.
- Structure Notes: Organize and link related Single-focus Zettels under thematic sections, starting each section with a relevant annotated WikiLink.
- Index Notes: These are used for navigation with a simple title annotation, listing relevant Single-focus or Structure Notes for easy access.
SEE ALSO Section:
- The SEE ALSO section serves as a gateway for expanded exploration and understanding, offering the reader pathways to discover related concepts and themes that might not be central to Zettel's current focus but are valuable for a broader understanding or future research.
- The separation between the Main Body and the SEE ALSO section helps maintain the focus and clarity of the main content while still providing avenues for further exploration and connectivity within the Zettelkasten.
- The SEE ALSO section should contain title-only WikiLinks that are not directly tied to the central theme of the Zettel but are still relevant to the broader thematic landscape of the note, including:
  - Index Note WikiLinks: Title-only WikiLinks to Index Notes that help with navigation and alphanumeric categorization but are not directly related to the Zettel's main content.
  - Distantly Related Zettel Links: Title-only WikiLinks to Zettels that provide additional context and support for the ideas presented or suggest further research but are not essential to understanding the primary focus of the current Zettel.
  - Hashtags and Metadata: The SEE ALSO can also include relevant hashtags and metadata that aid in organizing and retrieving Zettels within the Zettelkasten system.
References:
- List external sources or additional reading materials to support content validity and facilitate further exploration.

References

Ahrens, Sönke. 2017. How to take smart notes. North Charleston, SC: CreateSpace.

Sascha · April 8

@DataDisk said:
I’m completely new to this so I’m wondering; does The Archive allow for creating backlinks or not?

You just need to search for the ID of the note. Then you get all the backlinks to it.

ctietze · April 8

@ZettelDistraction said:
For me, a "backlink" is an ordinary forward link to a particular type of Zettel visited to see what else links there.

I'd argue that it's not a backlink if it's a forward link

ZettelDistraction · April 8

@ctietze said:

@ZettelDistraction said:
For me, a "backlink" is an ordinary forward link to a particular type of Zettel visited to see what else links there.

I'd argue that it's not a backlink if it's a forward link

Then we have an argument. I tried. 🤷‍♂️

DataDisk · April 8

@Sascha said:

@DataDisk said:
I’m completely new to this so I’m wondering; does The Archive allow for creating backlinks or not?

You just need to search for the ID of the note. Then you get all the backlinks to it.

Wow, that was fast. Thank you.

Zettelkasten Forum

How do you find notes and chain of thoughts without backlinks?

Comments

ZTEMP.1.0.24.0228 Zettel Template

Customization notes

Definitions

Reference Element Types

Types of Notes in Zettelkasten

More on customization

Revised Zettel Construction Guidelines

SEE ALSO

References

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