What tool do you use for notes not related to thinking and writting? (ZK)

Jvet

I mean notes like a project you are tracking, your favorite series, something you are preparing that isn't related to your ZK, a log about the health of your pets or family, your yearly or weekly plans, etc. I'm just curious.

Most of the time, I share an Apple note with my girlfriend so we can both keep track of goals or tasks we have in common. I would use another tool, but she is not into this basic geekery of markdown or linking notes; although at one point, we were deep into Workflowy and shared several nodes."

Sascha

I use my Zettelkasten for that, mostly for convenience.

I store my workout journal in my ZK, for example, and have a note called "My Training" which holds everything important to my current training plan (goals, benchmarks, sets, reps, framework parameters for autoregulation etc.). I also have a note with potential activities with my wife (my daughter is ~6 months old. So, it is getting dusty...)

I am a ZK zealot. So, almost everything goes into my ZK first. Only then I ask myself if there might be another place

Currently, I am working to find a satisfying solution for project notes. I use The Archive for that too, since it has enough outlining capabilities to be functional. But I like to have a different visual context for my current projects.

I use TaskPaper for my Second Brain approximation (mostly for future projects and attached reading material (=links)).

Will

@Jvet
I don't use my ZK for that, mostly for convenience.

I store and work with all the other stuff that is not knowledge work outside my ZK because the tools are generally better for those activities. Logs are either kept in my journal or in spreadsheets. References are kept in Zotero. Photos are kept in my photo manager. Web clippings are kept in Bear. When I work with friends on projects, I use tools that they are comfortable with. I find it easier to learn and use new tools rather than force them into using something they might not be comfortable with. Most of my projects are writing or coding and have their birth in VSCode.

I try to be a ZK purist and separate knowledge work from all the other flotsam and jetsom of life.

daviddelven

Last months, Tana for PM and KM (I don't consider myself applying a pure ZK method).

Readwise Reader and Zotero play their own role in managing references.

Jvet

@Sascha said:
I use my Zettelkasten for that, mostly for convenience.

I’m starting to think this is the next step for me I have my notes in bear but the more I think it, the more I convince myself to store everything in my zettelkasten. It just make sense to me because everything will be stored in one place, I just need to tag it, identify it correctly and connect it with everything related and meaningful. Even better, if the project or something evolves, I have a reference there to search it.

Currently, I am working to find a satisfying solution for project notes. I use The Archive for that too, since it has enough outlining capabilities to be functional. But I like to have a different visual context for my current projects.

I do too, at the moment I’m tinkering with the kanban view of Todoist, however, I also liked to use the free Trello version like Cal Newport does. One board for every role in my life and each list reflecting a different state of tasks. Because every card in trello can hold files or links, maybe attaching the markdown file or a link to it can be useful. Also, you can see every board in a timeline or calendar, reflecting the state of your tasks.

Let me know when you find a good solution though.

Congratulations for you and your wife regarding your daughter 🎉

Jvet

@Will said:
@Jvet
I don't use my ZK for that, mostly for convenience.

I store and work with all the other stuff that is not knowledge work outside my ZK because the tools are generally better for those activities. Logs are either kept in my journal or in spreadsheets. References are kept in Zotero. Photos are kept in my photo manager. Web clippings are kept in Bear. When I work with friends on projects, I use tools that they are comfortable with. I find it easier to learn and use new tools rather than force them into using something they might not be comfortable with. Most of my projects are writing or coding and have their birth in VSCode.

Thanks for sharing your experience. I’ve been trying as you say to separate things, but I get anxious when things aren’t in a specific and common place, maybe it’s my OCD lol, I do however struggle with anxiety disorder. It’s calming for me to know that everything will be just there, which is also non distracting and calm. Only with that context I can work .

Regarding bookmarks I’m trying raindrop, and for RSS feeds, read it later files and mailing subscriptions I’m currently trialing readwise reader. I don’t think I’ll subscribe after the trial, I find the cost too high for what I need. Also, Omnivore is an Open-source solution that does almost the same l, so I’ll go with that.

Jvet

@daviddelven said:
Last months, Tana for PM and KM (I don't consider myself applying a pure ZK method).

Hi, thanks for sharing you experience. How is Tana? In my personal opinion I don’t think an app that considers the atomic piece of information a node like roam can be used effectively as a zettelkasten. Maybe Tana manages it differently?

For managing everything else maybe it is good app! I’m still waiting for an invite though.

daviddelven

Hello, @Jvet

The Tana's focus is precisely the block/node, with its unique identifier, as well.
Here there is a list of very interesting implementations of ZK within the system:

By Kent Langley

By Theo Koppen

By Andre Foeken

By Cortex Futura

By Ev Chapman

And here it is an example of how I use it:

daviddelven

@Jvet Now if you just introduce yourself on the Slack Community you'll get an invite.

Andy

@daviddelven said:

Last months, Tana for PM and KM (I don't consider myself applying a pure ZK method).

Tana looks like what I wished FileMaker had been back in the decade of the 2000s (but not a web app—I didn't want, and still don't want, a web app; I just wanted a FileMaker that was more flexible than the relational-database model). In the 2000s I tried doing with FileMaker what people are now doing with Tana, but I had to give up because the relational-database model wasn't flexible enough.

Andy

@Andy said:

@daviddelven said:

Last months, Tana for PM and KM (I don't consider myself applying a pure ZK method).

Tana looks like what I wished FileMaker had been back in the decade of the 2000s (but not a web app—I didn't want, and still don't want, a web app; I just wanted a FileMaker that was more flexible than the relational-database model). In the 2000s I tried doing with FileMaker what people are now doing with Tana, but I had to give up because the relational-database model wasn't flexible enough.

I found this Twitter thread that confirms for me why Tana reminds me of FileMaker. It says:

Tana is a graph database. Thus it's ideal for interconnecting thoughts (backlinks, etc). However, this is not to say traditional relational databases are bad, rather they are also powerful. Tana is a graph database that allows us to create row/column-like data structures. We get the best of both worlds, both a graph database and relational database functionality. The graph is for outlining and creating tree-like structures. [...] Tana also allows for more traditional database views of data. A supertag in Tana is comparable to a table definition. It has fields, data types, settings & constraints. [...] Tana also can be compared to an object database. [...] So what is Tana? Is it a graph database? A traditional relational database? An object database? In many ways, Tana is all of the above.

Like FileMaker did for decades, Tana packages a friendly user interface with a database management system (DBMS) so that users can build custom database applications without needing to be programmers. Tana's innovation is a database model that is more flexible than the traditional relational-database model while still allowing relational-database structures, exactly what I thought FileMaker should have been 15 years ago.

Now someone needs to create a competitor to Tana that I can install on my computer, not a web app!

Jvet

@daviddelven said:
@Jvet Now if you just introduce yourself on the Slack Community you'll get an invite.

I will try that, thank you.

Jvet

@Andy said:
Now someone needs to create a competitor to Tana that I can install on my computer, not a web app!

I agree with that, that's why I like The Archive, and other apps like Bear or IA Writer.

Andy

@Jvet said:

@Andy said:
Now someone needs to create a competitor to Tana that I can install on my computer, not a web app!

I agree with that, that's why I like The Archive, and other apps like Bear or IA Writer.

I have heard (thanks to Google) that some of the functionality of Tana can be imitated to some degree in Obsidian with clever use of a combination of plugins like Dataview, Metadata Menu, and Supercharged Links. That would allow the storage of data not in some database file format on a web server but in many local plain text files—which is the data model that many of us in this forum have good reasons to use—while providing something like a graphical low-code development platform for building custom database applications, like in FileMaker or Tana but mostly for a single user. I would bet that what @daviddelven is doing in that Tana screenshot above could be done in Obsidian (with plugins) instead.

ZettelDistraction

I don't use any tool for notes unrelated to thinking and writing since I have to think about the note I am writing.

Jvet

@ZettelDistraction said:
I don't use any tool for notes unrelated to thinking and writing since I have to think about the note I am writing.

Hi! So you use an approach like Sascha and keep everything in one place?

Sascha

@Jvet said:

@Sascha said:
I use my Zettelkasten for that, mostly for convenience.

I’m starting to think this is the next step for me I have my notes in bear but the more I think it, the more I convince myself to store everything in my zettelkasten. It just make sense to me because everything will be stored in one place, I just need to tag it, identify it correctly and connect it with everything related and meaningful. Even better, if the project or something evolves, I have a reference there to search it.

Currently, I am working to find a satisfying solution for project notes. I use The Archive for that too, since it has enough outlining capabilities to be functional. But I like to have a different visual context for my current projects.

I do too, at the moment I’m tinkering with the kanban view of Todoist, however, I also liked to use the free Trello version like Cal Newport does. One board for every role in my life and each list reflecting a different state of tasks. Because every card in trello can hold files or links, maybe attaching the markdown file or a link to it can be useful. Also, you can see every board in a timeline or calendar, reflecting the state of your tasks.

Let me know when you find a good solution though.

Right now, I tend to stick to TaskPaper because there is no need to do a lot of importing/exporting. I already store project ideas and potential material in a TaskPaper file. So, the transition would be seemingless. However, TaskPaper doesn't support embedded images. So, I couldn't include them into my project notes. Zavala is not as nimble as TaskPaper.

Congratulations for you and your wife regarding your daughter 🎉

Thanks!

ZettelDistraction

@Jvet said:

@ZettelDistraction said:
I don't use any tool for notes unrelated to thinking and writing since I have to think about the note I am writing.

Hi! So you use an approach like Sascha and keep everything in one place?

Yes--it was a bad joke. I use pen and paper or email for notes outside of the ZK. Success depends multiplicatively on the factors involved--reducing the number of apps and the number and complexity of the steps within each app helps.